Car removed

[Trying Hard]

A very long story shortish. A bailiff removed a car off my driveway for less than £100 outstanding of Council Tax. I had paid £1400 direct to the Council, in cash, a week or so before. When the bailiff called asking for £2250 including various cost that he had added. I told him he had got it wrong and I had paid, showed him the receipt from the Council. He didn't seem interested and said he was ringing for a recovery truck to take the car if I didn't pay, which he did, damaging the car in the process by using a steel sling to pull it onto the lorry (£900 to repair).

The next day I went to the Council and explained what had occurred, they seemed to be a flustered, they hadn't told the bailiffs I had paid £1400.

Took a taxi (£65) to go and pick the car up from the bailiffs yard. When I got there I was told that £100 was still outstanding to the Council and the bailiffs fees were an extra - in total I had to pay nearly £900.

Couldn't drive the car home had to have it recovered after they had damaged it - £175.

Finally, my questions are can a bailiff take a car worth £1000's for a debt of less that £100 (even though they thought they were collecting a lot more), is this not disproportionate? It was the only thing available to them would they say? And the Council didn't tell the bailiffs that I had paid, what recourse, if any could I have? Council/bailiff?

Does the amount of debt on the form be the correct amount? What leeway do they have on this figure?

I know I have sort of answered my own questions but I would like some advice.

For the sake of expediency I have cut short a lot of the above and rounded up/down figures, not mentioned the make of car or value to keep a bit of anonymity. All this happened before the new rules for Bailiffs.

Any advice gratefully received.

Sorry for the long post, there is lots more to say but................

[zeke]

A very long story shortish. A bailiff removed a car off my driveway for less than £100 outstanding of Council Tax.

To be technical, there is no lower threshold for a liability order to be enforced. £100 is a bit extreme when councils charge £125 to apply for the order at the magistrates court having a fee of £3. It could have been an abuse of process, hard to prove.

I had paid £1400 direct to the Council, in cash, a week or so before.

If you have evidence of the flow of money, receipt etc, you have a good case.

When the bailiff called asking for £2250 including various cost that he had added. I told him he had got it wrong and I had paid, showed him the receipt from the Council. He didn't seem interested and said he was ringing for a recovery truck to take the car if I didn't pay, which he did, damaging the car in the process by using a steel sling to pull it onto the lorry (£900 to repair).

You bring a claim for the £900 damages against the council. Paragraph 35 of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 states;

• 35(1)An enforcement agent must take reasonable care of controlled goods that he removes from the premises or highway where he finds them.

The next day I went to the Council and explained what had occurred, they seemed to be a flustered, they hadn't told the bailiffs I had paid £1400.

The council is liable for the £1400 loss. You can bring that together with your £900 claim.

Took a taxi (£65) to go and pick the car up from the bailiffs yard.

These are normally called special damages, but the court will question whether the taking of the car was unlawful. You must show there was NO council tax owed on that date, otherwise, the cost of collecting the car is with the debtor- However, a few months back a bailiff company took a car 60 miles to a compond and sued for the cost of transport because the law says the bailiff must remove the goods within a "reasonable" distance. Paragraph 13(1) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 states:

• To take control of goods an enforcement agent must do one of the following—
  ...
  (b)if he finds them on a highway, secure them on a highway, where he finds them or within a reasonable distance;

When I got there I was told that £100 was still outstanding to the Council and the bailiffs fees were an extra - in total I had to pay nearly £900.

Without looking at the actual expenses at the pound, you can apply to the county court to example the bailiffs charges to see whether the charges have been paid by the bailiff or a contractor to store and transport your car and decide if it is a genuine expense. It is called a detailed assessment hearing: https://www.nationalbailiffadvice.uk/Di ... Court.html

Couldn't drive the car home had to have it recovered after they had damaged it - £175.

Paragraph 35 - damage to your car. The council is liable, but- and its a BIG buttt - you must notify the council and the bailiffs immediately on realising the damage: Here is more: https://www.nationalbailiffadvice.uk/Da ... liffs.html

Finally, my questions are can a bailiff take a car worth £1000's for a debt of less that £100

Yes, except in circumstances goods of a lesser value relative to the debt were available. If they were, you claim excessive levy, which current regulations do not address, but you can still use case law to ask a court to decide on case history whether the value of the car was excessive relative to the value of other available goods. Here is more: https://www.nationalbailiffadvice.uk/Ex ... -Levy.html

(even though they thought they were collecting a lot more), is this not disproportionate? It was the only thing available to them would they say? And the Council didn't tell the bailiffs that I had paid, what recourse, if any could I have? Council/bailiff?

Does the amount of debt on the form be the correct amount? What leeway do they have on this figure?

No leeway, the sum on the liability order must be precise. But that sum may have been paid before the bailiff attended.

I know I have sort of answered my own questions but I would like some advice.

For the sake of expediency I have cut short a lot of the above and rounded up/down figures, not mentioned the make of car or value to keep a bit of anonymity. All this happened before the new rules for Bailiffs.

Any advice gratefully received.

Sorry for the long post, there is lots more to say but................

[Trying Hard]

Wow guys thank you all very much for your quick response. I have a bit of reading to do, and if I may, I will come back.

As I said this is a long, long story and I didn't want to waffle on with every detail.

Before I removed the car from the compound I had the attendant note the damage on the release form before I signed it and took a few pictures. I also telephoned the Council from outside the yard to tell them of the damage.

With the car damage and bailiff costs (if possible) I am looking to recover about £1700 from someone.

When does the clock start ticking on this? Is there a statute of time with this or does that only apply to criminal?

As I said long story.

Thank you.

[zeke]

You have a technical time limit of 6 years, but you may as well bring the action now. Here's how to do it: https://www.nationalbailiffadvice.uk/Ta ... Court.html

[Trying Hard]

Sorry to have wasted your time, I should have given a date that all this occurred, 2010 is when the vehicle was removed and since then I have been trying to sort this out with the Council. So sounds like I am out of time. I don't want to go into detail why this has taken so long on a forum but lets just say the last eight years have not been the best. Big family problems, family deaths etc.

Once more I thank you for your time and the information given.

[zeke]

If you have been trying to solve the case with the council since 2010 then limitation starts from the date of last contact with the council. You can claim interest for a maximum of 6 years at 8% simple interest on your loss.